Hope Mangiafico (00:00)
Well exploded in our full episode about discernment at the
So that might be a topic f in which is brought up. ⁓
Nikki (00:09)
Thanks
Hope Mangiafico (00:09)
But we did just come off the episode about what is discernment, what it is, what it's not, and actually
Nikki (00:16)
you
Hope Mangiafico (00:17)
First and foremost, can I just say that my favorite part was basically our conclusion that discernment is trusting God? Like that tears up every denomination, every form of Christianity. No one really wants to hear that it's that simple because we want to discern the will of God and what we should do. And we boiled it down to it is trust. And that simplicity lit me up.
Nikki (00:24)
Yes.
Yes, it's not only trusting God, it's trusting what the Bible says is true.
Hope Mangiafico (00:50)
Mm. Good point.
and that's interesting thought because believing and trusting are two different things and a lot of us believe scripture, but do we trust it as truth?
Nikki (00:59)
Thank you.
That's right. That's what I was getting at.
Hope Mangiafico (01:07)
That's good.
That's good word.
Rust is so wild, like it is so difficult.
Nikki (01:15)
It's so, well, so difficult for me to trust because of my past. And we talked about the past in our episode and how that kind of.
causes triggers and reactions and responses and all of this, but because of my past, it's really hard to trust anything. But I'm working on trusting what the Bible says is true. Instead of like, that was a good story or, I love that, that's my favorite part.
Hope Mangiafico (01:31)
Yeah. Yeah.
Ooh, I definitely do that.
feel good story. Look at that go. That's so great. Look at that history book.
Nikki (01:52)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (01:55)
Wow.
That's a r really good I don't know what the word is, differentiator.
'Cause more of us I'm sure more often than not just read it and say it's a good story.
Nikki (02:06)
Yes. Yeah. Josephine, I just went through, we're going through the Bible. And we got to the part where who's talking? Who's the talking donkey?
Hope Mangiafico (02:08)
Yeah.
yeah, it's I for I messed up his name and went Yeah, it's yeah, it's Bashawn or something. Or Balam, I don't know.
Nikki (02:19)
It starts with a B, but anyway.
I think it's Balaam. I think it's Balaam the doggy. But anyway, like trust it like that could really happen.
Like it's there for a reason and you have to trust that it's there for a reason.
Hope Mangiafico (02:36)
So this leads to where I started getting on fire at the end. Because if we're talking about trusting the scriptures as truth, and I was getting fired up at the end of the episode, if you're listening to this now and you didn't listen to the episode, I got fired up because a lot of people use the excuse of we're in a different time, it's a different culture now. But the tr as I as I said in the episode, like he's the same today, yesterday, and tomorrow, then all of that baloney.
Nikki (02:40)
it
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (03:05)
goes out into the trash can for lack of a better term. And so going back to what Nikki shared in the episode about her age and, you know, dismantling the lie that it's too late. She's 52, blah, blah, blah. Like if we can believe that the scriptures are true, then we would authentically believe that because Jesus Christ came and broke the curse, that we could be 800 years old and do anything. We can get pregnant at 100. Like literally
Nikki (03:29)
Great.
Hope Mangiafico (03:34)
Do we believe it to be true?
Nikki (03:36)
Yes, and do I believe that as long as I have breath in my lungs that God can still use me? Yes, I do. Whether I'm 52 or 82, He can still use anybody.
Hope Mangiafico (03:39)
Right.
Nikki (03:48)
You're not washed up. can't be stuck. You can't keep doing the same old, same old thing day in and day out. If it's not your God given purpose, you can pivot at any point and go up on God's path.
Hope Mangiafico (04:00)
Yes. And sometimes we are actually missing the discernment because of our limited beliefs and we've got to break those.
Nikki (04:09)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Hope Mangiafico (04:11)
That's just another way of saying all the things we've said in the episode about trusting him. But I think we have to take full responsibility of saying my own belief systems have kept me stuck and unable to discern the will of God, his plan, his purpose. It's been me not wanting to change it. Yeah. Because sometimes we real I have noticed more recently for me, this is in a
Nikki (04:29)
And me.
Hope Mangiafico (04:40)
across many subject matters for me lately. But the way Holy Spirit's been working in my heart lately, I notice he hits a certain chord, like a string, you know, something that doesn't feel very good. When it becomes very difficult for me to repent of it. Like, what the crap, dude? Like, I love you. Why can I not get this out? It's because I've had such a tight fist around it. You know, it's stupid stuff that you wouldn't want, you know, like bitterness, anger, whatever. But it's like
I can't I'm gonna vomit repenting.
But if I don't get this out, I continue to limit my ability to know the will of God and what he's saying over my life.
Nikki (05:20)
And that's exactly the point I was just, that just dropped into my head, was just like, what happens when you keep blocking God's discernment?
What's the cost of that?
Hope Mangiafico (05:33)
your everything. I mean, can you even put a price on it?
Nikki (05:38)
No. But I know for like 20, 30 years, I'd just block all of his discernment.
Hope Mangiafico (05:45)
And we'll call it unanswered prayers. It goes back to what you said in the episode of sometimes it doesn't sound like how we want. So we block it. Looking for another answer, another solution.
Nikki (05:50)
Yes.
Yeah. And God's like, I'm trying to pull you out of something, but you're just firmly planted.
So guess you're just gonna be there for longer than I wanted you to be.
Hope Mangiafico (06:06)
Well, so that's interesting thought. Like if I go look at my notes from the episode and using the definition of discern from scripture, I put that it was two parts hear and listen to Holy Spirit, then you perceive what it means and understand it, and the last step is obey. So you have that ability to discern, but just like everything we've talked about, I don't know, probably
Nikki (06:23)
bright.
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (06:32)
At the end of every episode, probably, like that is the last step of everything is obey.
Nikki (06:36)
Yeah.
Yeah. And you have the choice not to.
Hope Mangiafico (06:42)
I'm repenting right here, right now. I have claimed to have the gift of discernment in different arenas, and we talked about this in the episode. Sometimes that's actually been fear talking or my past. But I'm repenting for actually being given the gift of discernment and not obeying it because of how do I say this? Misalignment with the father's heart.
We have ⁓ how do I say that? Our own heart postures. I I'm almost repeating what we're saying, but there's some there's a twist that I can sense is like trying to come out that and I think it's a word for all of us that we want discernment so badly and he will give it just like Nikki said.
Nikki (07:20)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (07:32)
When he gives it, make sure you have a clean heart.
Nikki (07:37)
That's right. Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (07:40)
It makes me think of taking communion. I don't know where it is and which ⁓ gospel it talks about it, but it's like don't do not take communion with anything in your heart. You gotta make sure you repent for anything Holy Spirit may bring up. It's the same thing with discernment. So obeying has a little caveat of is my heart clean in this situation? Because we can be given a gift.
Nikki (07:54)
Yes.
Hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (08:08)
Because he does not revoke gifts, which goes back to Nikki's point about all of this, ⁓ and not listening to it. So he will not revoke that gifting, but our dirty hearts will cause damage unintentionally.
You you oo you can obey with a bad heart.
Nikki (08:31)
⁓ yes you can. Absolutely you can.
Hope Mangiafico (08:35)
And that kind of damage that takes a lot of work to fix.
Nikki (08:39)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (08:42)
He's after our character. Character is the depths of who we are.
It's what people don't see, it's what happens in the behind the closed doors.
The real pausing happens behind closed doors.
It's probably why we talk about pausing so much. It is where we get the answers, but it's also where our character is built.
Nikki (09:02)
Yeah. Sometimes we don't want to pause. It's just popped in. It's because we don't want all the feelings that are associated with what we're dealing with to come flooding in.
Hope Mangiafico (09:14)
Abs ⁓
Nikki (09:15)
So used to being strong and like taking care of everybody else and doing the thing and keeping the train moving. And like, if we pause, sometimes we need to have that little, ⁓ emote session, tears, anger, frustration, the flooding in of all the emotions because we need to give that we need to surrender that to God. Cause we're not meant to carry it. So don't, don't resist it.
Hope Mangiafico (09:41)
Yeah.
Nikki (09:45)
I'm speaking to myself right now. Don't resist it. Let it out.
Hope Mangiafico (09:48)
Well, what's crazy is in the resistance though, Nikki, like you can almost still feel it. It's just right there on the brink.
And so it actually feels worse than just letting it out, but we still
Nikki (09:59)
What did you show
her right back then?
Hope Mangiafico (10:02)
But when you shove it you can still feel like it's about to implode. It's the goofiest thing that we do. Cause it's sitting right there anyways.
Yeah. And part of that goes back to what you shared in the episode about time. Setting aside time like if if it's something important, why do we expect to get a discernment on something quickly where we should set aside as much time as we like deem it as important, if that makes sense. and the same is true about like not wanting to feel the feels because we don't want it to take too much time. But if we feel that much intensely
Nikki (10:20)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (10:41)
It's probably gonna take time and it's actually a good thing.
Nikki (10:45)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (10:46)
All that said, still boils down to are we gonna trust him?
Nikki (10:54)
That's right.
Hope Mangiafico (10:55)
We're gonna trust her with her time.
Nikki (10:58)
Yes. Do we trust them or not? That's it.
