Nikki (00:00)
Have you ever been absolutely certain God was telling you to do something, only to look back later and wonder if it was really Him at all? Or maybe you've heard someone say, God told me, and something inside you just didn't sit right. Today we're talking about discernment, one of the most misunderstood gifts in the Christian life. Because discernment isn't just a feeling, it isn't just common sense.
Is something far more beautiful and far more demanding than most of us realize. Hi, I'm Nikki.
Hope Mangiafico (00:38)
Hi, I'm Hope. Welcome to Equipped Fellowship where friends become family through Christ. We're two Jesus-loving friends on a mission to share personal stories, resources, and real talk about our triumphs, breakthroughs, struggles, and setbacks. Why? Because we believe you are called to live victoriously, and we're here to equip you with Holy Spirit-led tools and strategies to strengthen your faith.
Transform your mindset and walk boldly in God's promises because here is the truth. You have been given great and precious promises by God. So grab your coffee, lean in, and let's grow together. It's time to step into everything God has for you and to discern it.
Nikki (01:19)
Woo! And that's what today's topic is. Today's topic is one that comes up constantly in church, yet it's rarely unpacked with any depth. Discernment. We throw that word around. She's got such a gift of discernment. You need to discern God's will. Be discerning about what you consume. But what does it actually mean? And maybe more importantly, what does it not mean?
Hope Mangiafico (01:44)
.
Nikki (01:49)
Because here's what I've noticed. A lot of what people call discernment is actually something else entirely. Sometimes it's personal preference, sometimes it's suspicion, sometimes it's pride dressed up in a spiritual language, and all that matters because when we confuse those things with true biblical discernment, we
can cause real harm to ourselves and to others. So today we're going to slow down, open up the scriptures, and get a
Clear idea about what discernment is, where it comes from, and how it actually works in the life of a believer. So let's get into it.
Hope Mangiafico (02:29)
I use this word all the time and I got convicted a while back that I was hiding behind the word discernment. So I'm curious as we unpack this.
anyone else walks away with that conviction and that clarity and that freedom. It is thrown around and I am guilty of just throwing it around. I'm like, ⁓ radar is going off. Got it.
Nikki (02:54)
Totally.
Bingo. It really is something that I'm just like, I felt the, I felt the shift in my spirit. I felt the discernment. Like we we use so many different words to describe it. And what I kept coming back to this morning when I was thinking about discernment, your discernment is your perspective or your blinders up to whatever your foundation is.
Hope Mangiafico (03:04)
Yeah.
Amen, that is the truth. And you know, I started getting my own convictions a while ago and then I, once you...
You know this, Nikki, and probably listeners too. Once the father highlights something to you, you start picking it up in other people. So if it's a word, you start hearing other people saying it. And I started noticing their traits, personalities, the differences between us, yet we're treating this the same. Something's going on in both of us, not just them. And that's when my eyes really started opening up to exactly what you just said, the foundation, the grounding, the pausing.
Nikki (03:35)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (03:57)
And see what is this that's coming out of me? You know, is it the preferences like the intro said, right? Is it my past? Is it my judgment on this person? I mean, girl, I want to say that most of us claim discernment when actuality, is our past talking.
Nikki (04:07)
Right.
Hope Mangiafico (04:18)
because our foundation until we let him work in our heart is our past, which we have talked about many times on the episode.
Nikki (04:18)
Yeah.
And
I found like my discernment would change, like my perspective of discernment would change depending on who I was letting cover me. So like I've said on this past before, like I spent oodles of money under this one person, and did my discernment would have been so different. It would have been on ⁓ shaky ground. But I would have thought I was hearing from the Lord, but I actually wasn't. So it depends.
Hope Mangiafico (04:42)
Mm-hmm, yeah.
Nikki (04:54)
We gotta be have our writer our what we're allowing to cover us and what we're allowing our focus to really narrow in on. And that's gonna shift our discernment like a pendulum, but we want it to be straight and narrow on God, the Bible, Jesus, the truth.
Hope Mangiafico (05:16)
Amen. And you know, what was also highlighted to me as you're talking about who you're under and you're talking about people, right? And like judging and judging circumstances and people based off who you're submitted under, I started actually once I was done taking my notes for today,
I was still chatting with the father about it, right? Because he's like, man, this is getting really interesting. And I felt very strongly that the only thing that we probably can be pretty confident in our discernment on once we start our journey with the father is actual spiritual environments. If that makes sense, like when you go into a certain city and you don't feel good, you could probably trust that because unless you have some crazy, crazy history there, like it's probably accurate.
But it's when we start intermingling people, the submission, the interactions, that's where I think as a body of Christ, we have gotten very muddy.
Nikki (06:17)
Yes. Cause then we get into intuition territory, which is not discernment.
Hope Mangiafico (06:18)
and
Mmm, can you elaborate?
Nikki (06:27)
So intuition would be like worldly discernment. So intuition would be like, ooh, I feel this, but you don't really have any grounding to back it up. Like like you're intuitive, like I am intuitive. So this is how I am perceiving this situation.
Hope Mangiafico (06:31)
I'm
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
that leads really well into something that, again, my own journey, going back to like your past experiences, making you intuitive. I have found that the people that have lived in the most emotionally unstable environments claim to be the most discerning or the most intuitive. And this is under my category of something I've been guilty of.
Nikki (07:12)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (07:17)
And I noticed that everyone that starts throwing that word around most frequently are the people that had to be hypervigilant. And again, we call it intuition, ⁓ but in actuality, and sometimes we'll call it wisdom, but in truth, it's because we don't know how to take our guard down and process with Holy Spirit. That's what I have noticed and that's what I've noticed in my own life. Like I thought I was so discerning and I do believe
Nikki (07:37)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (07:45)
I have discernment. But was it accurate every single time? Absolutely not because I was on edge.
Nikki (07:46)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Right. Yes. And I've worked I work through that too. And I've worked through a bunch of clients with it because it's just like like you're talking about hope. We have our history, right? We all have our own personal history. And because of our own personal history, we each have triggers, good or bad. Or medium, whatever. And then we get to determine our reaction. So then we have our history, our trigger.
Hope Mangiafico (08:06)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Hmm.
Nikki (08:23)
And our reaction and sometimes our reaction can be like, ⁓ our our intuition has sparked our whatever it is that hooked us into that history is how we respond. Good, bad, or ugly.
Hope Mangiafico (08:35)
Yeah.
absolutely. And I guess even going from using history to lead us to our reaction, that can also, I guess another word that can be thrown in there is like judgment of something and calling it discernment, whether that's of the situation, the person, there is a preconceived
Nikki (08:57)
Mm-hmm. ⁓
Hope Mangiafico (09:04)
judgment already there, which then justifies our reaction. In our brain, it justifies it, And how we treat someone or how we react.
Nikki (09:13)
Yeah. And I think maybe before we get any further, because I'm loving this conversation so far, but I really want to lock in at like what discernment actually is.
Hope Mangiafico (09:24)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is, think that's great. I'll be interested to see what you have versus what I got, because that is what I started with But you know, it's always good to start with what we're familiar with, and probably everyone could relate to everything we shared.
Nikki (09:39)
That's
right. That's right. And so like I had to I had to define for myself like what is discernment? Like what do I think it is? And ⁓ I was looking up a Bible verse and then I got James 1.5. If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask God. And then for me, discernment is the ability to distinguish truth.
Hope Mangiafico (09:42)
Hello.
Nikki (10:08)
From a non-truth. Think like it's at the very basic level, what's the truth and what's not the truth. And that helps us recognize God's voice among all competing voices in our lives. And so you can take that truth or non-truth even further to help us recognize God's voice is like, is this something God would say or not? What's the biblical truth about this?
Hope Mangiafico (10:09)
Mm hmm.
Nikki (10:39)
And then going a layer deeper, discernment is seeing situations through God's perspective. Again, what
Hope Mangiafico (10:44)
Yeah.
Nikki (10:45)
does the Bible tell us on this? And discernment, and some some people may think this, but it's not true. Discernment is not reserved for pastors, prophets, or super spiritual Christians. We all have the ability to use disturb dis.
Hope Mangiafico (10:52)
Okay. Okay.
Nikki (11:08)
discernment
Hope Mangiafico (11:13)
I agree and what I did for defining is I went to good old Strong's Concordance and I pulled from Old Testament Hebrew words and I'm not gonna say them. I'll give the number for Strong's Concordance to keep it simple. But the first one is H8085 and it means to hear, listen,
obey. And there's another one, H995, which is said kind of like bean. So I'll say that one because that's I wrote it. And that is to understand, consider, perceive. So instantly once I read those two words, I viewed discernment as two parts available to anyone. You hear and listen Holy Spirit, which is available to anyone because if you claim Jesus Christ, you have Holy Spirit.
And then with the pause, you perceive what it means to understand it. So this is where the wisdom comes in and not the intuition or the worldly knowledge, which we're gonna dive deeper into because we already cracked the door open with that one. And you follow up with obedience. That's all that it is. And that goes to what you said about truth versus non-truth. If you hear and listen Holy Spirit, you'll get the truth.
You'll perceive what it is. You'll have all your good history with the Father and knowledge as you read more and more scripture to perceive it and understand it and then obey in however you're supposed to.
I love that. And I love that you emphasize how it's available to everyone because oddly enough we have not done an episode on like the gifts of the spirit, which is kind of funny. I'm surprised we haven't done anything like that. But there is sometimes it's like, just it's like, you discerned that well and just kind of throw it to the wayside and then you see like a pastor or something that's got this gifting and like we label it with the gifting and
We have, scripture says, to desire all gifts, which means they're all available to us. Our key is partnering with Holy Spirit in a moment.
Nikki (13:24)
Yes.
Yes.
Because we don't think we have it. And I've I relied on other people gifts when I probably should have just sat down with God and let Holy Spirit come in and minister to me. But I've seen this at my church especially. They're like, well, I'm gonna go talk to so and so because they have the gift of discernment.
Hope Mangiafico (13:34)
No.
Yeah. Well, and I think there's so much freedom in that and sometimes I think the heart behind why people feel like they need to do that is because you do read Bible stories, right? Where
Nikki (13:49)
God's gonna tell you. God's gonna tell you what you need to know. We don't always need people to be a liaison to God for us because how they interpret it might not be how God intended it.
Hope Mangiafico (14:16)
Paul was doing all this work, Peter's doing all this work, and so we have these isolated individuals in scriptures that are highlighted. So then we translate that to today to this individual can do this thing, not me. But we forget the actual, oh, I wish I had my Bible, not that it really matters, but I keep trying to grab it and it's not here. This overarching theme of the New Testament that all was available to us as followers of Christ. Everything is.
But to have scripture, you have to have evidence of that truth. So we have individuals that are highlighted, but it doesn't mean they were the only people that could perform the miracles. They were on assignment by Christ through Holy Spirit to do the job. And it's that simple.
Nikki (14:59)
Yes. Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (15:01)
So we can't extract those and just then start saying, no, this person only can do this and this person could only do that. No, no, no, big theme, zoom out, seeing the big picture, right?
Nikki (15:12)
Yes. Yes.
And it all comes back to that. How are you creating a strong foundation relationship with God?
Hope Mangiafico (15:21)
Yes.
Yes.
Nikki (15:25)
'Cause if it's rocky, if it's shaky, your discernment's gonna be the s same way.
Hope Mangiafico (15:30)
Yes, and that kind of leads me to like one of the notes that I wrote was what we need to do in moments that we believe we are discerning, tying into your foundation part, is first John four says, beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God. So that foundation has to be firm on him and then you can do your first step, which is testing the spirit that's operating in that moment. And
Nikki (15:48)
Hmm?
Hope Mangiafico (15:57)
I'll be honest, historically when I heard testing the spirit, all I see is like Satan versus God. But I got this like check, and when I was writing this down, that testing and having that good foundation to help back that testing, and you pause, you gotta check your heart because actually it's your heart that's often manifesting the wrong spirit. So,
There can be a spirit of jealousy, of fear, of bitterness, of envy, and that can make us believe we're discerning with Holy Spirit. But once we pause, we can actually sense that misalignment with our good foundation.
Nikki (16:36)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (16:37)
I used to only test the spirit of all the yuck, yuck, yuck instead of the heart yuck.
Nikki (16:42)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (16:43)
But your foundation with the Father is not only built on His character, but it's how are you letting His character activate in your life and align you with Him.
Nikki (16:53)
Right.
Because I've seen in other people and sometimes me, sometimes what I'm calling discernment is actually my fear and anxiety creeping in and making murky water. I I get part of the picture, but it's not clear.
Hope Mangiafico (17:02)
Exactly. Exactly!
Murky's a great word because you're not necessarily missing the point, and we have said this many times, where like we start on the right path and we'll call it a curlicue in this situation, but it's not a curlicue as in necessarily being distracted as much as a curlicue because that's part of our life that hasn't been fully surrendered yet.
And that is a, that's a place I've lived in probably more often than not because those are hard routes to let him rip up all the way.
Nikki (17:42)
And sometimes when you're dealing with fear and anxiety or stress over a situation, you cannot think clearly. And you just want real quick solutions, real fast. And that's when I personally stop checking in with God because I just want to fix it as fast as I can. And I'm not waiting for the discernment. I'm not waiting for the download.
Hope Mangiafico (17:56)
Yes.
Yeah, no
Nikki (18:11)
Like we talked about last week, we're just going.
Hope Mangiafico (18:14)
Well, I kind of then use discernment to back my actions, you know, versus letting discernment lead me. I'm having fear and I'm like, well, I'm just being responsible and discerning that movement is better than standing still because standing still leads to failure, you know.
Nikki (18:19)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (18:32)
So it's so important to do that testing of the spirit. And you know, Nikki, you're talking about fear and anxiety. I've talked about bitterness, jealousy, envy, fear, anxiety. We know fruit of the spirits do not contain those. It's love, joy, peace, patient, kindness, goodness, gentleness, self-control. So if you can't figure out what it is, but you feel the tension,
Nikki (18:46)
No.
Hope Mangiafico (18:55)
Well, is it love, joy? mean, is it making you feel good? You want to boil it down to that? How's it feeling in that moment? And then go from there.
Nikki (19:00)
Yeah. Right.
Hmm?
Hope Mangiafico (19:06)
Keep it simple because Nikki, you're so right in those moments where you just wanna fix it. You can't make it overly complicated because you're gonna become more resistant to what you need to actually do.
Nikki (19:19)
Yes. And like you've said episodes a while ago, you know, how your word for the year is daughter and when you're talking about God was like, is this something a father would say, a loving father would say to his daughter? You know, you can ask yourself that, or does this sound like something God would say? Right.
Hope Mangiafico (19:35)
Right. Right. To you or about someone else if you're trying to
discern if this person's for you or against you. gotta. Yeah. Exactly. And that goes so well to like so step one's testing the spirit. Step two is shutting down the false Holy Spirit, the lies, anything that's coming from the enemy's camp that segues so well to that.
Nikki (19:45)
Yes. Simple checks, like you said. Just a simple check.
Hope Mangiafico (20:04)
Does this sound like something from a loving father? Is it a warning that doesn't instill fear, but rather a warning of, daughter, just be mindful? Same outcome, different feeling.
Nikki (20:10)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (20:19)
Big deal.
Besides pausing, so that step I wrote down personally shut down the false Holy Spirit and the lies. What, I'm putting you on the spot here, I hadn't thought about this. What else would you deem as like tools to like stop and shut down those things that are leading you down the wrong path of discernment?
Nikki (20:42)
This is a quick little thing that I just learned two weeks ago ⁓ from a pastor at our church, one of them. And quick, easy, and effective. She's like, just stomp your foot on the ground. Just stomp your foot. Like with stomp ⁓ the head of Satan. It's just like that. You don't have to say anything. Like he knows you're a child of the most high king. And when you put your foot down, you're putting it down for
Hope Mangiafico (20:57)
Mm.
.
Nikki (21:11)
the kingdom of God. So I've just been doing that lately, just like doing a you can do it in public. You can do it anywhere because you're not being verbal. You're just stomping yourself. And it's just like that little trigger of like, okay, get get back on the kingdom path, or like don't let that thought land, or like we're shutting that thing down that just popped in. We're just stomping it out right here and then. And it just helps me move on and gain some clarity and it it's a slight pause.
Hope Mangiafico (21:19)
Yeah.
Nikki (21:40)
you know, to let your brain catch up, but then I can make my next step a better
Hope Mangiafico (21:47)
I like, I love that idea. And I also like how you just presented it of like, it helps me move on because I can get stuck on trying to discern something. So I really like that. Or.
Nikki (21:54)
Mm-hmm.
Or you start covering with the
blood and binding it and all these th you know, just he knows. Move on.
Hope Mangiafico (22:08)
Yeah, and that's a word just in general because some of us then get so caught up in the moment of trying not to make a mistake or make the wrong move or judge or whatever a fear of doing the wrong thing in regard to like listening to the wrong camp doing an emotion like that of just stomping whatever helps you kind of get out of that murky mud and getting stuck because
This episode is about discernment and you might be a person, this has also been me, where I'm doing all these things, I'm testing the spirit, but I'm stuck in that moment and now I'm afraid because what if I get it wrong? And so bam, do something that just breaks that because getting stuck, confusion is not of God either. And boy, have I lived in that place.
more often than I care to admit.
That's good, I like that, just a little movement. And you know, sometimes I love like nervous system stuff and everything, but I forget to translate doing exercises, if you will, to my spiritual life.
Nikki (23:15)
Yes. Yeah. And depending on the situation, sometimes I stomp my foot and then I put up my shield of faith.
Hope Mangiafico (23:21)
Mmm.
Nikki (23:23)
To stop the enemy's fiery darts from taking hold.
Hope Mangiafico (23:27)
Yeah, that's great. Yeah, it's really, really good. I love that.
So, and that's really cool because that allows you to like pivot after shutting down or it allows you to shut it down. And then it opens that door to being able to lean into the Holy Spirit and ask for his truth, which goes back to the Strong's Concordance definition of discernment, which is hear and listen.
We can't hear and listen in the noise and the chaos and the stuckness ⁓ in the history of our life. you know, like, I'm so glad we asked you for that because there's such a need to stop whatever is going on in your brain in that moment.
Nikki (24:12)
'Cause if you think of
it this way, we've talked about this before, like our ear or ear gate. Like if it's if it's clogged with stuff that's not supposed to be in there, everything outside is muffled and jumbled and we don't get a clear voice. So if we're holding on to all this yuck trying to listen to God, we're we can't discern what he's saying.
Hope Mangiafico (24:36)
Yeah, that's like episodes like three, four, five, somewhere way up there. Yeah, we talked about tuning to the frequency, getting all the gunk out. And I think as you and I both have grown, we continue even today for me at least to understand how easy it is to get gunk in there. Because the closer you get to the father, you gain more clarity.
Nikki (24:45)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (25:02)
but also because you're giving him more access into the depths of who you are, it can be a little more sneaky of a lie that gets in. If that makes any sense, if you're walking with Holy Spirit right now, you probably understand what I'm saying because you're letting him into the depths, but those are the depths. So then your clarity also is a little less strong because those are the depths of what you've been believing for so long. Does that make sense?
Nikki (25:13)
Mm.
Yes, it does.
Hope Mangiafico (25:29)
So we really gotta implement the shutting down and then the leaning in and hearing and listening. And that leads really well into what you were saying as well earlier, I ended up labeling as a curlicue, but once you do that, being careful not to leave that place of alignment.
Nikki (25:59)
Mm.
Hope Mangiafico (25:59)
You introduced that a while ago in this episode. but there so many times where I believe I started out right and it may have been correct that day, but it shouldn't have carried on into the next day or the next week. I didn't stick with the alignment of what Holy Spirit was doing.
Nikki (26:14)
Mm.
Yes. I've done that a lot also. And when thinking about this topic during my Jesus time yesterday, it made me realize that when I am looking for a discernment on an issue, a person, a thing, or something coming up in my life, I should budget in the time for that. I should schedule that time in with the Father.
Because those are some pretty important things. And if I'm expecting to get some on on the fly discernment, it's probably not gonna be quite in the alignment category that I'm looking for right now as a believer. And
Hope Mangiafico (27:04)
Hmm Hmm
Nikki (27:08)
you know, some people can do that and do it well. I I can't right now. So I really need to sit down, budget in that time, and just
Wait on the Lord. And it's that's not what we want to hear. And it may take coming back time and time again to get the download, to get the next step, to do the thing. But if we want true discernment that's in alignment with him on a strong foundation, sometimes it happens like that. It can happen quicker. But I'm just
Hope Mangiafico (27:40)
You
Nikki (27:42)
saying we
And I think that's why, like you said, Hope, sometimes I forget to keep checking in.
Hope Mangiafico (27:49)
Yes.
Nikki (27:51)
Because it does take time. But we prioritize time in so many other areas in life. We can if we really want to prioritize time for this also.
Hope Mangiafico (28:02)
One thing about how different our heart posture would be if we actually would, quote unquote, train ourselves to expect it to take time, how much more patient we would be, grace-filled we would be, joyful we would be if we
Nikki (28:13)
Hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (28:18)
would start just expecting that the father's best work is slow.
Our culture doesn't really allow for that, so it's a lot of untraining. ⁓ But if we could train ourselves to expect that, boy would we have so much more clarity.
Nikki (28:27)
Mm?
And talk about a good foundation, a good model. That's what Jesus did. He did things and then went away and spent time with his father. And sometimes it was a long, long time, and sometimes it was shorter.
Hope Mangiafico (28:45)
And then like.
Or it makes me think, like, gosh, people coming up to Jesus after, you know, someone's died like Lazarus or a little girl that we've talked about when we talked about the miracles, they're like, you're too late. And he's like, I'm in no hurry, because I'm the son of God and I know what I'm doing. Hope's words, not his, but my own interpretation.
Nikki (29:12)
Yeah,
never like frantic, like, what am I gonna do? Like what's next? Like I gotta do other things. Like
Hope Mangiafico (29:20)
It's such a good reminder. But it's like how do we make that practical in our day to day of how we can start operating from a place of slow, steady, peaceful, and letting that be our, as you've been using the term, foundation. ⁓ I'm getting better at it, but I want my expectation to be slow and steady instead of still my expectation is quick, quick, quick, while I'm failing. ⁓
is how you know there's a problem with my foundation because it's, hope's not doing enough, hope's not doing, you know, I'm, I'm, me, me. Yeah, I got some work to do still because that is not, that takes off. It removes his role as soon as I start doing that. And then what can I do? I cannot hear clearly. can't. Ugh. Ugh.
Nikki (30:08)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah.
And I wrote, ⁓ sometimes we want certainty more than we want God. Discernment isn't about controlling outcomes. It's about trusting God.
Hope Mangiafico (30:23)
Amen. Trusting is a heart of obedience and a lot of times we want to also define obedience as action. May we flip that definition to being trust is obedience. And I had that, you have to obey.
What you're saying is trusting. And the thing about obeying and trusting is it can look like waiting. It can look like speaking. It can look like acting. It can look like praying and interceding. But we cannot know without the spirit alignment. And through the trust is the only way that you can know if you're supposed to speak, act, pray. It's the only way to do it. You can't obey without trust and we all need to do it.
inward heart look and be like, if we are not trusting the Father, we can't obey him. That's convicting.
deepest heart cry is to obey.
Nikki (31:20)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (31:21)
But to get there, you gotta trust, and we all have so many areas we're not trusting him.
So that's what the sermon boils down to, trust. Is that what we just landed on?
Nikki (31:31)
I
think so.
Patience and trusting.
And and getting discernment from God is not always gonna give you the answer that you wanted. Unfortunately.
Hope Mangiafico (31:47)
Yeah, what's... Father, can you just remove my wands, please? That would make life really easy.
Nikki (31:54)
I mean, I remember one time he was just like, and now we're closing down your business. And I was like, like when? He's like, like, now now and I
Okay. And that's when you have to be obedient. And that's when you have to do it. And that's when even when you don't understand why, you gotta do it anyway.
Hope Mangiafico (32:15)
Yeah, and the foundation you've already built did help you trust him in that area enough to obey. Kind of a full circle moment to what we were just talking about.
Nikki (32:23)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (32:26)
We are all growing in this concept of being able to trust without understanding. And that's the thing about discernment that is really interesting is
I would say I would use, again, history, past, people, whatever, and deem it as an understanding.
But remember that usually the things of God you will not be able to comprehend on a natural level.
Nikki (32:59)
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (33:00)
Spiritual understanding is usually things you cannot describe in words. That's why, like, in our podcast, when we get going, I'm so grateful because, like, these are not concepts I could ever explain to someone without Holy Spirit guiding us in this process. Because I'm still, I'm still growing, right? I'm still on the journey of discerning. So, and I, so I don't have an understanding.
Nikki (33:19)
Right.
Yes.
Hope Mangiafico (33:29)
You and I could not move without this part of our life at least being surrendered and we're trusting him in this area.
Nikki (33:37)
Right. Yes.
And it has been getting easier because he does show up when he needs to show up and he does shift things when he needs to shift things, even though we might be like, Why is it shifting? Why can't we meet today? Like, what's going on? And he's like, Ladies, I got it. You're covered. You're covered by a good God. Trust. And like we said in last week's podcast, like it just all worked out. It worked out so good, better than we could.
Hope Mangiafico (33:53)
Right.
Nikki (34:08)
ever put together ourselves.
Hope Mangiafico (34:11)
Absolutely.
Absolutely, and you know that to me our friendship has been about 10 years and whether it's talking about a real-life friendship or your journey with God life is a journey of alignment and growing and You took the words out of my notes and it gets easier with time. That's literally what I had written
Nikki (34:31)
Mm-hmm.
Hope Mangiafico (34:36)
And the biggest thing is continuing to not give up and trusting His grace enough to carry you through it when you don't get it right every time.
I'm working on that.
Nikki (34:55)
And I had written down Psalm forty-six, ten, and I think this is gonna be a good anchor scripture for this episode. It says, Be still and know that I am God. If we're not still, we're letting other things come in and be God.
Hope Mangiafico (35:04)
Hmm.
Yes.
Nikki (35:13)
But he says, Be still and know that I am God.
Hope Mangiafico (35:13)
Yes.
And that's a stillness that's within. So sometimes we try and force ourselves into a Jesus corner to sit down, but it's the internal stillness. And we all know what the internal chaos feels like, let him calm that on the inside.
Nikki (35:26)
Right, yeah.
Yeah, you could say that as an anchor verse and as you're going through the day and those thoughts come in or those fiery arrows are being shot at you and just be like, be still and know that I am God. And you can add on, like, and I know my God is good, and I know my God is for me, and I know my God created me on purpose for a purpose. All those things that strengthen you to get you Jesus' up for that moment.
Hope Mangiafico (36:03)
Yeah.
Nikki (36:07)
To continue on.
Hope Mangiafico (36:09)
And it can happen so fast where all of sudden you're like, well, I feel like a different person. That's the best feeling in the world. When you're spiraling. No, that's a that's a great scripture. And I know a lot of people that's like, whether it's in a season or for a long time becomes like a life verse for them.
Nikki (36:11)
Yeah.
Mm.
Hope Mangiafico (36:29)
And I think you've highlighted a great point that it's something that we should have in our back pocket all the time because that scripture builds trust. And we literally kind of accidentally summarized discernment as trusting the Father. And that's how you build that clarity in your ear to hear, to obey and do as will.
Nikki (36:55)
And that's how you can check your discernment too. You can say that verse. Be still and know that I'm God. God, what do you have to say about this? Did I get it right? Am I off track? Did I hear something wrong?
Hope Mangiafico (37:09)
Nikki and I talk so often about pausing. And I know at least for me, for this episode, the heart cry that I think actually for majority of our podcast episodes have been like, do not be afraid to pause because pause will never mislead you. And I think we've expressed that in different ways. But today, let that sink in. And I'm talking to myself that being still and pausing
will never, ever mislead you.
Nikki (37:41)
And you won't miss it. If you're afraid of missing something, you won't. He's a good father. He's not gonna take something away from you.
Hope Mangiafico (37:43)
Veebray.
Absolutely.
Nikki (37:52)
He has it for you and he will still have it for you.
Hope Mangiafico (37:56)
Hmm.
Nikki (37:57)
I mean, I'm fifty-two and I'm just learning that now. And I feel like I have a whole list of things that he wants me to accomplish. And it's his timing. It's not my timing. And I'm okay with that. But people would be like, but you're fifty two. Why would you no? It don't matter. It doesn't matter. Look at all those old people in the Bible doing their thing.
Hope Mangiafico (38:20)
I was literally gonna say I have been in
my own brain referencing the old people in the Bible a lot for a lot of different reasons because
I mean, I don't even have to explain why. It's enough that like when that stupid voice comes in about you're too late for this, you're behind on this, you should have done this sooner, blah, blah. Like remember those people, are they Old Testament? Yes, does that matter? No, because it boils down to is it the same God? Is he the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow?
Nikki (38:49)
Yeah.
Yes, he is. Amen.
Hope Mangiafico (38:54)
I hate, sorry, that gets me on a whole other soapbox. That can be saved for the overflow of, well today the times are different. That'll be saved for the overflow. I'm gonna shut my mouth.
Nikki (39:04)
Yep.
Yep.
Hope Mangiafico (39:07)
Will that do it?
Nikki (39:10)
I think so. I think that'll do it.
Hope Mangiafico (39:13)
You
Nikki (39:15)
I have a closing encouragement.
Hope Mangiafico (39:18)
Perfect.
Nikki (39:20)
Maybe you're listening today and you're desperately trying to figure out what God wants to do next. Maybe you're standing at a crossroads in a relationship, a career decision, a parenting challenge, or a season of healing. Can we encourage you with this? God is far more committed to leading you than you are to finding the right path. He is a good father, and good fathers don't hide from their children.
If you're seeking him, spending time in his word, and inviting the Holy Spirit to guide you, you can trust He is leading you. Even when you can't see the whole picture, discernment isn't about getting every decision right, it's about staying close to the one who does.
Hope Mangiafico (40:13)
Mmm, so good. Friends, before we close, we want to leave you with this, complimenting what Nikki just said. Discernment is also not about being the most suspicious person in the room, using your past to define and being walking on eggshells trying to figure everything out. It's also not being the most confident, trying to be the most spiritually gifted person, or spiritually impressive, if you will.
Just like Nikki said, it is about being so close, to the voice of the shepherd. Because remember, we're sheep. That you can tell the difference when something else starts speaking to you. And that, just like Nikki said, takes time in the word. It takes humility, true humility, because there's a false humility out there too. It takes community, which we've talked about many times, and it takes a willingness to
to be wrong sometimes and learn from it by His grace. If today's conversation stirred something in you, if you have questions, pushback, or a story of your own, we genuinely want to hear it. Reach out on any platform in which we stream or leave a comment and tell us what you think. And if this episode helped you, the best thing you can do is share it with someone who needs it. Pass it along to a friend, a small group, or your pastor, whoever comes to mind. But until next time,
We'll see you in the overflow and keep seeking, keep asking, and keep your eyes fixed on the one who is true, who will show you the discernment.
